Now when he was at Attica, what kinds of things did he tell you that he believed about the people there. What were his hopes and what did he feel that the place was doing to people. What were his concerns about the conditions?
He didn't like the way men were treated there. He thought that it was dehumanizing and he felt that although the men there were paying for a crime or whatever, they were still men and should be treated like men. He felt that the guards, or some of the guards I should say, were horrible, some of them were really horrible in the way they treated the inmates. He felt, so strongly that, whenever he came out to visit, when we'd go up to see him, he would come out and he would, um, give the Black Power salute, it was in defiance I think, not anything real mean or nasty, but just to, just to show that I am a human being, I am a man, I make choices, even though I am behind bars.