THERE WAS A CONTROVERSY ABOUT USING IT, WAS THERE SOME FEAR?
Well, the—there wasn't so much a contro—there was a controversy about using it, but it was among the arrogance of lawyers who felt that social science was not a hard science. It was soft and that all of this was just opinion, and so forth. So I had a great deal of difficulty with the lawyers who were sort of dismissing all this, this psychological and sociological information as being worthless. And fortunately, Thurgood was the boss, so Thurgood stood with us and we kept Kenneth in. But that's how it, that's how it happened there was, it—lawyers, a number of the lawyers didn't feel that this was worthwhile. They looked down on the social science[sic] as a science.